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Post by Rajiv on Nov 2, 2016 12:18:19 GMT 8
From the "Filling places & choices" thread: From the "New timing for Sunday game at The Grandstand" thread: For the Sunday game at Khalsa, we had 8 players for 23 October 2016. 30 October 2016 was the Deepavali weekend, so I didn't make any effort to try to fill the game. Apart from the Sunday night game at Grandstand not filling up, the Saturday game at Grandstand has been relatively slow to fill up for a few weeks now. Further, for several weeks now, the weeknight games have been filling up better than the weekend games. The Sunday night game at Khalsa is intended to provide more places for those who play the weeknight games. I will continue to schedule the Sunday night game at Khalsa until the end of November 2016. .... The Sunday evening game at Grandstand will resume from 13 November 2016 onward, at the usual time slot, 5 to 6 pm. .... And from the schedule thread for a game this Sunday (6 November 2016) at Khalsa: got to be kidding....you have poorer response for this game than Grandstand but yet to choose to continue scheduling it here. In addition to the considerations set out above, the reasons are fairly simple:
- When both the Saturday and Sunday games at the Grandstand are struggling, I'm not going to put in a lot of effort to try to fill up both games, especially when the new management there are being difficult with me. It makes more sense to consolidate the numbers into one game. The Saturday game is currently more sustainable, so it survives.
- The Sunday night game at Khalsa is to cater for those who can't get a game Monday to Thursday due to the games on those days filling up, with up to half a dozen players left on waitlist. Further, the management at Khalsa don't give me any hassle. In any event, it will take a while for players to get round to a new game.
As I have pointed out many times before, my aim is to give people opportunities to play. There are always games available, especially if players are flexible about days, times and/or locations. Unfortunately, some games, and some players, become cliquey over time. The risk is that numbers for such games, even if once popular, dwindle over time. There is only so much I can do to introduce new players. Those who are keen on a particular game really have to do more to make that game sustainable, including being more accommodating of newer players (bearing in mind that being overly competitive may deter newer players), being more welcoming so that those who try out that game will come back in the future, and if necessary, introducing a larger number of new players. |
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Post by Gerard N on Nov 4, 2016 13:29:43 GMT 8
Looking forward to next Sunday's game at Turf City. Hopefully you guys will sign up too.
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Post by Rajiv on Oct 27, 2017 10:01:31 GMT 8
Kelvin Neo asked me to put himself and 3 friends/relatives down for the game on Thursday, 19 October 2017, at Khalsa. Kelvin had only played 5 times before, since Q3 2014, at long intervals. His friend Raoyan had played a couple of times before, in Q4 2016. Wilson had played once before, in Q1 2015, while Matthew was playing for the first time. I understand that Kelvin and Raoyan are good, but Kelvin informed me that Wilson and Matthew were unfit. Kelvin also requested that the four of them be on the same team. I explained to him that it would be difficult to get balanced teams, especially with so many unfamiliar players on one team. Nevertheless, he asked that they be on the same team, which I accommodated. After the game, Kelvin messaged me to say the line ups were not balanced. I do try to accommodate 3 or 4 players requesting to be on the same team. As set out on the "Guidelines To Selectors On Team Selection" section under the "Guidelines On Team Selection, Organization & Game Play" thread: .... If one or both teams are built around a group of friends, the remaining players should be split between the two teams in such a way as to make the teams as evenly matched as possible. It should be borne in mind that a team with players who are very familiar with each other or complement each other is likely to have a strength over and above their individual strengths. If is not possible to make the two teams fairly even, then it is advisable not to use such groups of friends as the basis for the two teams .... .... It is helpful if at least some of the group of friends/relatives are fairly regular, so we have some sense of how they will fit into the game. It is so much harder when the entire group are new or relatively new. It is also not fair to the other regulars or players in that game. I have suggested to Kelvin that he play more regularly. Even then, based on the report, I thought the game was not too imbalanced. There were again requests for the game yesterday (again, Thursday night at Khalsa), for groups of friends to be on the same team. Again, I accommodated the requests. It was easier to balance teams as apart from one new player, the rest were or had been regulars, or had played before on Thursday night. As reflected in the final score, the game was more balanced. From the report thread for the game last night (Thursday) at Khalsa: Even match with reds and whites both having spells of dominance in the game. Must say people calling out decisions constantly and not letting the game flow made it a bit sad. .... The Game Rules provide as follows: Game Rules: .... - Players are expected to play in the right spirit. During a game, captains may agree that a disruptive player should leave the game for 5 to 10 minutes to cool down, compose himself or reflect on his conduct. Repeated or serious instances of not playing in the right spirit may result in sanctions. The following are examples of not playing in the right spirit:
- Committing a deliberate foul, or calling out to a team mate to commit a deliberate foul.
- All forms of gamesmanship, including but not limited to winding up opponents (over and above mere banter), simulation and feigning injury, repeatedly making unnecessary calls during a game or stubbornly insisting on calls going in one's favour, or calling out to an opponent to pass the ball to you in order to confuse the opponent.
- Excessive arguing and unnecessary displays of hostility, anger, or aggression towards other players, whether on your own team on the opposing team.
- Over-reacting or retaliating, whether in words or by overzealous tackling, or blowing up incidents to try to influence decisions.
- As we play without a referee, if a player involved in a passage of play calls a foul, unless the player committing the foul or his team captain concede the foul, continue the play until the ball goes out of play or is in the hands of a goalkeeper. When a foul is called, don’t just leave the ball for the opposing side and stop playing. Sometimes, they will continue and score. At first instance, the matter should be left to the players involved in the passage of play. Other players not involved in the passage of play can express an opinion, but don’t press it. The final word is with the team selectors/captains. If the call is conceded, it resumes with the free kick or penalty as the case may be. Where there is a genuine dispute, and no agreement is reached, the following rules of thumb shall be applied to expedite matters:
- If the player on the receiving end of the tackle or challenge is physically hurt or suffers greater physical impact than is a normal incident of our games, it is presumed to be a foul, resulting in a free kick or penalty. It should not lightly be alleged that a player is feigning physical hurt. However, a player's past conduct is a relevant consideration. Therefore, my advice to all players is do not develop a reputation for simulation or feigning physical hurt. It will be held against you.
- If the player has committed an act that is in any event disallowed as set out above, this will weigh against him.
- All genuinely 50:50 calls should be decided in favour of the team trailing by 2 goals or more.
- In every other case, it is presumed not to be a foul, and the game continues from where play stopped.
- If necessary, the dispute can be resolved later, in the post-game discussions, or on the report thread for the game.
- If a corner is called but disputed, then it is a goal kick.
- Team selectors/captains can apply the "zip it" rule. If any player argues excessively or too aggressively, either selector/captain can, facing the player from a reasonable distance, run an imaginary zip across his mouth. This should be done from a reasonable distance in order not to inflame or aggravate the situation. The player concerned should not utter a word for 5 minutes thereafter. Selectors/captains can apply the "zip it" rule to any player on his own team who he thinks is being too vocal.
.... The Overriding Principles provide as follows: .... Our games, and the playing rules set out in the post below are geared towards (i) keeping the game flowing (ii) while reducing the risk of injury and (iii) are intended to accommodate different styles of play. These are Overriding Principles. All Game Rules should be interpreted and applied in this light. Further, our Core Values are: - Maintaining health, fitness and/or interests even as we get older through sustainable participation in sports and other activity.
- Facilitating a work-life balance.
- Voluntary participation with maturity and in good spirits.
- Achieving a balanced and healthy perspective on sport and competition.
- Enhancing appreciation and understanding of teamwork and co-operation.
- Developing friendships and finding enjoyment through participation.
All games are expected to be played, and all Game Rules interpreted and applied, in accordance with the Core Values. The Game Rules are set out below. The two team selectors/captains for any game can, between themselves, agree to modify the Game Rules for that particular game, as they think necessary or desirable. During a game, the two team selectors/captains also have the final say on the application of the Overriding Principles, Core Values & Game Rules. If the team selectors/captains cannot agree, the issue should be discussed on the report thread after the game, and may be followed up on the appropriate announcements and developments thread. Any residual dissatisfaction after the game can also be discussed on the report thread for the game. .... As I repeatedly point out, our games are a balance between social football and a competitive edge. For each game, the regular players, especially the captains, determine where the balance should lie. If a player feels the balance is way off the mark, let me know, and I will see if redress is needed, and what form it should take.
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Post by Rajiv on Aug 19, 2018 10:51:34 GMT 8
From the "Latecoming, late withdrawals & no shows" thread: One of the players from last night's game (Tuesday night, 5-a-side at The Grandstand) messaged me after the game to say that Anthony Goh had been 15 minutes late, and asking me to speak to him about being persistently late for games. I asked the player if he had brought it up with Anthony's team captain, and he said no, so I raised the matter with the team captain. The team captain told me the following today:
- He did not think it was a matter of Anthony being held up at work, as he was also late for weekend games.
- If Anthony was going to be late, the least he could do was apologise on the WhatsApp group chat.
Since Anthony first started playing in Q4 2015, his being frequently late for games has been brought to my attention several times, and I have messaged him twice about this. I have brought his attention to this thread, and reminded him to be at the game at least 10 minutes before the time the game is scheduled to start, and to give himself sufficient time to reach the game on time. As pointed out several times in this thread, it is a matter of time management.
.... I hadn't heard anything for a while, but Anthony's latecoming came up again at the end of July 2018. I had another chat with him, as follows:  I am informed that Anthony has been late more than once since then. I have no choice but to act. The following sanctions take immediate effect:
- Anthony will be excluded from team selector/captain polls until further notice. I do not see how he can be selector/captain if he has great difficulty abiding by any of the GIFFA values, principles and standards, in this case, punctuality.
- He will not be given the first report credit unless he states the time he arrives in the report. If he is more than 5 minutes late, he will not be given the first report credit. Anthony often does the first report credit for the games he plays in. While I appreciate his effort in this respect, being prompt should apply first to being on time for games, before being first to post a report. Again, this will apply until further notice.
The situation will remain under review.
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Post by Rajiv on May 14, 2019 9:09:39 GMT 8
For some time now, players have been clustering around the Monday night game at Macpherson and the Wednesday night game at Khalsa. We have had up to 10 players on waitlist within 24 hours. The Thursday night game at Khalsa continues to struggle to fill up, and the Tuesday night game at Macpherson which I tried to introduce hasn't taken off yet. From the "Filling places & choices" thread: .... For April and May 2019: - Those who remain available for the games on Tuesday night at Macpherson and Thursday night at Khalsa will have priority in the first 24 hours after the schedule thread goes up for the next games on Monday night at Macpherson and Wednesday night at Khalsa.
- Those who remain available for the Sunday evening game at Grandstand will have priority in the first 24 hours after the schedule thread goes up for the next games on Saturday evening at Grandstand Tuesday night at Grandstand.
- Those who remain available or the game on Tuesday night at Macpherson will have priority in the first 24 hours after the schedule thread goes up for the next game on Tuesday night at Grandstand. Players can put their names down for both Tuesday night game, indicating their preference against their name.
I will continue to apply the priority adjustment indefinitely. As numbers for the Monday night game at Macpherson and the Wednesday night game for Khalsa have eased up in recent weeks, I haven't had to impose the additional admin fee for withdrawals after the selector poll is put up. I have also been putting the selector poll up later, so players have more time to withdraw if they need to. The regular games are to give players an opportunity to play. On the other hand, those who put their names down should be committed to play, and should only withdraw in the event of exigencies. If players are more flexible about which games they play, and then having put their names down, are committed to play, the system would work a lot better. |
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Post by Rajiv on Aug 21, 2019 11:43:00 GMT 8
From the "GIFFA system & playing rules" thread: Places for each game are based on a priority system. Although ordinarily, priority is based on the order in which names are placed on the schedule thread, there are the following exceptions: - Selectors/captains from the previous week's game have first priority in the first 24 hours.
- PRG players who commit to less popular games have priority in the first 24 hours for all games scheduled on the day of that game and the next 6 days. ....
- PRG players are allowed to put one name other than their own in the first 24 hours, and and additional name in the next 24 hours. Any names exceeding these limits lose priority within those periods.
- Players who have not played with us before or are not registered as GIFFA players (that is, guests) have no priority in the first 48 hours.
- If, within 24 hours of the schedule thread going up, a game fills up and has players on waitlist, and continues to have players on waitlist until the selector poll goes up (not more than 24 hours before the game), but withdrawals after the selector poll going up resulting in the game being cancelled or postponed, those who had a confirmed place when the WhatsApp group chat was created, but withdrew after the selector poll went up, will lose priority in the first 24 hours after the schedule thread for the following week's game goes up.
- Anyone who owes for more than one previous game when the WhatsApp group chat is created will lose priority and be moved to the bottom of the list.
Additionally, players who owe more than $50 (including the game they wish to put their name down for) are not allowed to put their names down for any game.
Our primary routine games are about giving more players the opportunity to play across a broader range of games, rather than fewer players rushing to grab or hog limited placed in a few games. It's not about getting your name in within the first couple of hours, but about making the commitment within the first 24 hours to play. Within that first 24 hours, players who are supportive of the system benefit in return.
Selectors/captains having priority has been in place for several years now. And from the "Reports, polls & chat" thread: ....
..., in the first 24 hours of the schedule thread for the following week's game being put up, the selectors, captains, and the first PRG player from each team (and the first of any non-playing PRG player) to provide an account before then, will have priority. Currently, the games that fill up and have players on waitlist within the first 24 hours are:
We have had up to 12 on waitlist for popular games, enough for a second game. This may not include other players who did not bother to put their names down after seeing so many on waitlist. I have considered mini-tournaments (4 teams, 2 hours) or playing three teams over two hours to accommodate more players in the popular games, but the change in format has not been popular.
Giving PRG players who play in less popular games priority in the first 24 hours for popular games was introduced first for the Monday night game at Macpherson in January 2019, and then for all popular games by July/August 2019. Not surprisingly, the first time the issue has come to a head is for the Saturday game this weekend (24 August 2019).
For each of the three popular games, there is an equivalent game at the same venue and at about the same time on another day of the week (originally, Sunday evening at Grandstand, Tuesday night at Macpherson, and Wednesday night at Khalsa). However, despite my best efforts, including asking around extensively, these three games have been difficult to get started or sustain.
It does not make sense to me, that despite having enough players for these 3 pairs of equivalent games, one of each pair fills up fast, sometimes with long waitlists even within the first 24 hours, while the other of each pair struggles to fill up, and is always, often or sometimes cancelled, even after I ask around, depriving those who commit to those games of a game.
As stated above, the entire system is based on a pooling effect, and on everyone being accommodating and flexible. In giving players an opportunity to play, I seek to accommodate as many players as possible. The least I would expect is for those who benefit from the system to reciprocate by being accommodating and flexible.
I now schedule 8 games a week, so everyone who wants a game should be able to get a game, provided that they are accommodating and flexible. Apart from the 6 games at the three venues referred to above, there is the Tuesday night 6-a-side game at Grandstand (Rainforest) and a Friday night 5-a-side game at Kallang (The Cage). Regular PRG players clustering or hogging places in one game or one of each pair of games undermines the entire system.
The equivalent second game for each of the three popular games is now Sunday evening at Grandstand, Sunday evening at Khalsa, and Thursday night at Macpherson. To make it clear, for now, the priority system for more popular games will only apply to related games, that is, Sunday evening at Grandstand for Saturday evening at Grandstand, and Sunday evening at Khalsa and Thursday night at Macpherson for Monday night at Macpherson and Wednesday night at Khalsa.
There are other ways of gaining even greater priority within the first 24 hours, such as being selector or captain in the previous week's game, or writing a first report within the first 48 hours of the previous week's game.
A simple value - those who work with the system and for its benefit, will benefit in return.
Further, as new players only get a place if there are still places, or places become available, 48 hours or more after the schedule thread goes up, the regulars for the more popular games being familiar with the less popular games makes it easier for them to introduce new players. As several players drop out over time or don't come back, new players are essential for the pooling effect, and the sustainability of this entire platform.
If players can only play on a particular day, time and/or venue, and are not interested in contributing in other ways, there are other avenues to find games, such as Stranger Soccer. I have neither the time nor inclination to pander to every whim or fancy of players, especially players who are themselves neither accommodating nor flexible in return.
If 14 to 16 regulars or more for any particular popular game disagree with me, and want to run the game themselves, they are welcome to do so. There is a precedent for this. When in May 2009, I having difficulty sustaining a Monday night game on a small covered pitch at Grandstand, Tom took over the running of the game. Other players later took over from Tom. Later, that game was switched to a big pitch covered pitch at Grandstand when one became available on Monday. Even later, the game was switched to a big covered pitch at Grandstand on Wednesdays when a pitch became available for that day, presumably because it is easier to fill a midweek game than a Monday night game. It shows that regular players can run their own games to meet their own needs if they so wish. I am sure the Wednesday night game has its own method of deciding priority.
Ultimately, first come first in is a rule of convenience, nothing more. My purpose is to accommodate as many players as possible, which is a value central to the whole system. I do not need a mad rush for popular games in the hours, minutes or even seconds after I put up the thread for the game. Every PRG player who commits to playing within the first 24 hours should get a place. Unfortunately, if the number of PRG players committing to play within the first 24 hours exceeds the number of places, I have to decide how priority between them is to be determined. Following from the above, within the first 24 hours of the schedule thread for the popular games being posted, priority is as follows (based on the value provided by the player):
- Selectors/captains from the previous week's game. This could be up to four places, as a selector can appoint another player from his team as captain.
- The first player from each team to do a report by then. That is a further 2 places.
- PRG players who commit to playing in the related less popular game in the 7 days up to the day on which the schedule thread goes up. The related less popular game may vary from week to week. Basically, it is any game at the same or nearby venue in a similar part of the day which has not filled up 72 hours after the schedule thread for that game is put up.
- In the order in which the names are posted (including one name of a PRG player other than that of the player posting himself).
Those who are accommodating and flexible, to the benefit of the system, should themselves benefit. A simple enough value, applied transparently.
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Post by Rajiv on Feb 9, 2020 10:40:31 GMT 8
From the "GIFFA system & playing rules" thread: .... The challenge match has been a expedient solution. The Saturday evening challenge match organised first by Aschkan and now by Raj Singh has become a regular feature. It gives the regulars a greater say on how the game is organised, including who gets to play in that game. It also allows me to focus on the newer Saturday evening game at Khalsa, to allow those who can't get a place in the Grandstand game, or don't want the hyper-competitiveness of the Grandstand game, to get a game. .... We have now had a Saturday evening game at Khalsa two weeks in a row ( 1 and 8 Feb 2020), and although for now it will still require some effort to sustain, I do see it being established as a regular game. Anyway, it is currently the game I myself am most likely to play! From the report thread for the night game on Monday, 24 Jan 2020, at Macpherson: .... Should both captains be deprived of their additional $1 credit for being so late? I've added a poll. 3 players voted that they should be deprived of their additional $1 credit and no player voted against, but I think I need more players to vote before I deprive the captains of their additional credit, so I will give it to them this time. However, they will be excluded from the selector poll for all games for three weeks (until 14 February 2020). Just a reminder that captains should take their responsibilities seriously, including being early. The credits (like the penalties and admin fees) are token, but penalties, admin fees and withholding of credits are intended to serve as a reminder that players shouldn't ignore the repeated reminders. .... One of the two captains was Anthony Goh. And from the report thread for the evening game on Sunday, 2 Feb 2020 at Grandstand, after it came to my attention that Anthony was late again: .... I have reminded Anthony several times about being punctual. .... .... Those who play at Grandstand are generally fussier about punctuality. For weeknight games, players may from time to time be held up at work, so we may excuse occasional late coming, especially if the player provides an early heads up and apology on the WhatsApp group chat, but for weekend games, there is less excuse. Those who choose to play particular games should make a greater effort to conform to the standards and reasonable or legitimate expectations of those who regularly play in that game, including collateral expectations such as punctuality. Returning to Gerard's point in the WhatsApp group chat, it is the frequency of Anthony's late-coming that is particularly galling. At the very least, an apology on this thread is required to receive the report credit and any first report priority for the following week's game. I may also put up a poll to allow players to vote on whether Anthony should be blocked from the Grandstand games for a period of time. Sorry for being late on Sunday will be on time in future. I trust Anthony will stick to his word, and I did not add any poll. However, Anthony Goh's exclusion from the selector/captain poll has been extended to 28 February 2020. No point a player whose compliance with the basic requirements of our game is under scrutiny being allowed to be selector/captain. From the night game on Tuesday, 14 Jan 2020, at Grandstand, after a newer player told me he walked out of the game early in the session: I don't think the issue of what is a foul or not can ever be resolved to everyone's satisfaction; even with VAR, as we've seen from the English Premier League. In the end, I have to trust the captains, and both captains have messaged to say they didn't think there was any foul committed, let alone one bad enough for the player concerned to so fear for his safety that he had to walk out of the game. As I informed James soon after he first messaged me, a player leaving the game (other than for an injury or other urgent personal matter) spoils the game for everyone else. .... .... Just write ban for life. Short simple sweet. Haha In 13 years, I've only ever banned 1 person. I don't think you've done anything so special that you deserve to be the second. .... Anyway I'm migrating to Canada soon. Won't be around. Take care all. I thought you were saying you wouldn't be playing anymore. If you're still keen to play, I'll help you find a suitable game for you. Tonight even. Would you like to play tonight, 8.50 to 10 pm, Macpherson? The private messages I got from some of the Tuesday regulars were much more strongly worded. I disabled the player's account so that he could not put his name down for games, in particular the Tuesday game (no point him returning so soon and inflaming the situation) and over the next few weeks, encouraged him to try out other weeknight games, or the new game on Saturday, but he was not available for any of these. Yesterday, I enabled his account, and he immediately put his name down for the night game at Grandstand this Tuesday (11 Feb 2019). I trust there will be no repeat of what happened last time. Or any incident for that matter. Also from the "GIFFA system & playing rules" thread: .... The aim is to be as inclusive as possible. The name of this forum is "Generic Indoor Football For Adults", to cover as many types of "indoor" football as possible. 5 or 7-a-side football (including futsal) started off being played indoor, but all our pitches are now outdoor (even though the ones we use at the Premier Pitch @ Grandstand are covered). To reflect a primary value, I will change "Indoor" to "Inclusive". .... The other key element in the name is "Adults". Our games are for adults, not just in terms of age, but in temperament as well. Adults know how to manage time, and how not to over-react to every incident. If despite several reminders, a player fails in material respects to show an adult temperament, then I really have to consider if the player is suitable for our games. And from the "Safety, health & sustainability" thread: |
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From the "New timing for Sunday game at The Grandstand" thread:
got to be kidding....you have poorer response for this game than Grandstand but yet to choose to continue scheduling it here.
