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Post by Rajiv on Feb 7, 2014 20:18:25 GMT 8
Making choices can be more complicated than we realise. From the "Making time to play & punctuality" thread: .... In several of the games with uneven numbers, the game actually turned out reasonably well. In fact, I would say the proportion of games with uneven numbers that turned out reasonably well was not a lot less than our average. A lot has to do with the attitude of those who turn up for the game. If most of the players take it in their stride, the game usually turns out okay at least. If players become angry and upset about no shows, it can undermine the entire mood of the game, and it increases the likelihood of the game being unenjoyable. Players come into games with certain expectations. If those expectations are undermined by a no show, it is easy to get angry and upset. However, if the players are adaptable and make the necessary adjustments to deal with the situation, the game usually turns out ok. Uneven numbers can arise in a number of circumstances. The following has been in the Playing Rules & Principles thread for some time: .... * If one team is a player short due to uneven numbers, a no show, late withdrawal, fatigue, injury, illness or a player leaving the game, we try to find a replacement at the venue itself. If a replacement cannot be found, we continue with one team a player short. The team with the extra player is restricted in its scoring to within an imaginary line running through the penalty spot for the opposing goal. The same if one team is short due to a player being late. If the team that is a player short is losing badly in the second half of the game, a player from the side with the extra player should switch to the team with a player short. The scoring restriction is also switched..... .... I've added the following to the "Scheduling" section of "The GIFFA System" thread to make this clear: Accordingly, I have renamed the "Scheduling" section as "Scheduling & numbers". Players should re-read "The GIFFA System" and the "Playing Rules & Principles" threads to remind themselves what our games are really about, before considering what they want to get from our games. I'll deal with no shows, late withdrawals and other breaches of the system and rules. Everyone else should just try to make the best of the games they play in. .... And I've added a poll: No shows are again in issue. .... With immediate effect, I will also keep track of the following over a rolling two year period:
- No shows.
- Very very late withdrawals (less than half an hour before the game).
- Very late withdrawals (3 to 1.5 hours before the game).
- Arriving late (more than 5 minutes late).
- Arriving very late (more than 15 minutes late).
The poll is above. As the poll question is too long to fit in the poll, I'll repeat it here - "Team selectors/captains should be allowed to replace players with poor records on latecoming, late withdrawals and no shows with a player from the waitlist who does not have a poor record." What is a "poor record" is open to further discussion, but before we go there, I'd like to settle the principle of allowing such replacements to be made. I'll leave the poll open until at least one-fifth of those on the Approved List vote. |
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Post by Rajiv on Feb 9, 2014 20:14:58 GMT 8
From the "Venues & team sizes" thread: .... Based on experience, the numbers for our various venues/pitches are as follows: - Covered big pitch at The Grandstand - Maximum 16, minimum 14 (both played to the side lines).
- Uncovered big pitch at East Coast - Maximum 14 (played off the side padding), minimum 12 (played to the side lines).
- Covered pitch at Kallang - Maximum 10 (played off the side walls/padding, minimum 8 (played to the side lines).
- Uncovered pitch at Khalsa - Maximum 14, minimum 12 (both played to the side lines).
There are also players who have informed that they only want to play 7-a-side, and not 6-a-side, at East Coast. The issue of only wanting to play with the maximum number, and not the minimum number has arisen again, both for the game today (Sunday) at The Grandstand, and for tomorrow (Monday) at East Coast. .... Please indicate against your name if your playing is contingent on having the maximum number. Please also add your name at the bottom of the list, as shown in the following example: Although under the "Filling places and withdrawals" section of The GIFFA System thread, it is expressly provided that: .... Only put your name down if at the time you put the name down, you are reasonably sure you will be able to attend and play. .... .... and I do not generally allow names put down contingently or based on a condition to take up places, as only wanting to play if the maximum number is reached does not deprive anyone else of a place, and allows a game that might otherwise not fill up to fill up, I will allow it, as set out above. |
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Post by Rajiv on Feb 20, 2014 9:30:58 GMT 8
A reminder that in putting your name down for a game, there is a degree of commitment to play in that game. Sometimes, the mind is keen, but the body isn't ready (due to uncertainty whether the player will have recovered sufficiently from illness or injury). Sometimes, the body is ready, but the circumstances are not yet in place (due to uncertainty over which game to play in, or personal schedules). If the uncertainty is significant, then the player isn't really in a position to make a commitment, and should hold back on taking up a place. There are always other games in our schedule. However, many players tend to stick with the games they are familiar with. If the player nevertheless wishes to indicate his interest in a particular game, but isn't yet in a position to give sufficient commitment, then he can put himself down on waitlist. Although it doesn't guarantee him a place, if there are still places available the day before the game, I will ask that player first. I have recently made some changes to the GIFFA System thread, touching upon filling places and choices. These have been further expanded as set out below. - Under the "Filling places & withdrawals" section:
.... For a player's name to be put down on the list, his participation must be unconditional, except that if a player only wishes to play if we reach the maximum number, he should put his name at the bottom of the list, and indicate as such, either against his name when putting his name down, or as soon as possible thereafter, and no later than 4.5 hours before the game, by posting on the same thread. Any other condition or contingency should be indicated in the same way. If a player's participation is contingent on other matters, he may be moved to waitlist until either he confirms his participation is unconditional or the contingency is fulfilled. .... For the reasons set out in the post above, being contingent on reach the maximum number is an exception. The following passage was previously added: .... No matter what prior appointment or engagement you may have, you should start making your way to the venue no less than half an hour before the session is due to start. If you are held up or are running late, and there are players on waitlist, rather than arriving more than 10 minutes late, please consider offering your place to the players on waitlist rather than arriving very late. If the players on waitlist are no longer available, the place is still yours, and you will be expected to turn up as early as you can make it. , the following had been added to the GIFFA System (now under "Payments & penalties": .... If a player offers up his place to those on the waitlist, I will not treat it as a withdrawal, as long as the player remains available if no one on waitlist is still available. .... - I have added the following at the end of "Filling places & withdrawals", after "If having put a name down for a game, you subsequently realize that the player cannot make it, please withdraw the name immediately by posting on the same thread.":
.... .... If there remains a possibility that the player might be able to play, and wishes to have priority on waitlist, instead of withdrawing, he can switch to waitlist, in which case, he goes to the top of the waitlist. If he withdraws, then subsequently puts his name down again, he goes to the bottom of the waitlist. In line with the tightening of the rules, I am applying the rules more strictly. I have also made the cancellation policy clear, by adding to the "Pre-game protocol & weather policy" section of the GIFFA System thread, the following, after "If 48 hours or less before a scheduled game, we are well short of the minimum number, the game may be cancelled.": .... .... If 30 hours or less before the scheduled time for the game, between about half and the minimum number of places are filled, I may create a WhatsApp group chat of those who put their name down to see whether we can get at least the minimum number, or whether they are interested in switching to a smaller pitch (subject to availability). If due to withdrawals, we fall below the minimum number any time before the session is due to start, the game may be cancelled. I've renamed the section "Pre-game protocol, cancellations & weather policy". |
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Post by Marko on Feb 24, 2014 17:14:39 GMT 8
In response to James' question on group whatapp:
Jan 6, 2014 at 2:55pm Quote
Select MessageDeselect MessageMemberSend MessageGive GiftBack to Top.
.hi both,
Mark - I have to call out on the consistent late withdrawals by you in the past months.
I do understand occasional withdrawals due to personal matters, work, etc, but to consistently pull out after putting the name down is not nice. It seems routine now that we need to have 2 spares for monday games for the last couple of months.
I am not sure if this is a problem with others but it sure bugs me. If the rest is okay and Rajiv you have no issue with it then I will accept with the current situation.
j.
Jeff - thanks for your PM.
I am surprised by your comments by "not nice" as we are all just following the rules. Perhaps you got upset that by us withdrawing on the day makes the game unable to materialise?
Of course, when we put down our names, it already expressed the intent to play. Otherwise, I would not have spent time login and putting my name down.
Others wish really wish to play can always put themselves in the reserve if they are keen and subsequently make it into the first 14 if anyone withdraw.
Shawn and I want to play together (this is our chance to catchup as well) and naturally there are higher chances we might pull out togther.
E.g. one has to work late, wet pitch, family, and many other reasons and different people have different piorities.
I hope you understand I am coming from on a positive note.
Thanks.
Best Regards,
Marko
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Post by Boon Yick on Feb 24, 2014 18:10:48 GMT 8
By and large most players have observed the rules of the game in both form and spirit. However there have been more than the odd incident of players withdrawing late on the day of the game but keeping within the rules so as to avoid the penalties. While it can be argued that this should pose no significant issues to an occurrence of a game, in reality it can become a source of irritation to players who have signed up for the game, only for it to be cancelled on the day of the game due to late withdrawals (albeit within the permitted timeframe of 4(?) hours) and insufficient players on the waitlist to fill the void. On a few occasions there have been last minute scrambles to get players to fill in so that the game could go ahead. I think we can all accept the occasional late withdrawals by players due to health reasons, injury, work and family commitments. The key word here has to be "occasional". When it becomes a habit and repeated week after week, we then have a question on the level of commitment to play by these players. I therefore strongly feel that these players who cannot ascertain whether they would be playing due to recurring personal commitments or reasons, should put themselves on a waitlist. This is hard to enforce since the burden is on the player to exercise his discretion and consideration and unexpected events do crop up at the last minute. The mitigating factor is therefore the frequency of occurrence. In addition to the above I would like to propose that players who due to personal commitments withdraws on the day of the game for 2 consecutive weeks will only be allowed to put his name on the waitlist the following week regardless of whether he is committed to play or not. Alternatively we can impose a fine on players who withdraws on the last day consecutively for 3 weeks in a row.
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Post by Rajiv on Feb 24, 2014 18:49:02 GMT 8
The period from 30 hours before the game onwards is now covered by pre-game protocols. For me, a withdrawal is ordinarily not late unless it is made 4.5 hours or less before the game. The question posed by James Y on the WhatsApp group chat was: To be fair to Marko and Shawn, there has only been one late withdrawal (after 4.30 pm), and when we had a series of Monday night games at East Coast being cancelled towards the end of last year and early this year, it was for a variety of reasons: - There were a remarkable 12 withdrawals for the game on 21 October 2013 which left us with 10 players. Even though a small pitch was available, not enough players were willing to switch to a small pitch, so the game was cancelled. Marko actually withdrew the day before the game. At that stage, we still had 12, and although we managed to get one more player, further withdrawals by Ben Y, Alex F and Jeff S left us with 10.
- We were stuck on 12 up to 6.10 pm on 16 December 2013. Marko had earlier informed me that he may not be able to leave his reservist camp on time, but he stayed in until he was sure. At 6.10 pm, Marko confirmed he couldn't make it in time, so we were down to 11. Again, not enough players were willing to switch to 5-a-side, so the game was cancelled. The cancellation was not due to a withdrawal before 4.30 pm on the day of the game.
- We were stuck on 11 for the game on 30 December 2013, and again, not enough players were willing to switch to a small pitch, so the game was cancelled. Neither Marko nor Shawn put their name down at any time for this game.
- Even after asking around, we struggled to get to 9 by Sunday for the game on 13 January 2014, and when Kelvin and Melvin Au withdrew on Sunday night, we were left with 7, so the game was cancelled.
It can't be said that any of the above cancellations were due to Marko and Shawn withdrawing before 4.30 pm on the day of the game. When they have withdrawn on other occasions, it has usually been early enough to get replacements, allowing the game to go on. Anecdotal accounts and impressions suggesting otherwise are not reliable. Further, the replacements have sometimes been players who don't play often, because they wait until they are sure before committing (usually after 5 pm, when they know they can leave work on time), so in a perverse way, Marko and Shawn withdrawing on the day of the game sometimes gives a game to players who don't often get the chance to play. However, there have been several times when they have withdrawn from three games in a week - the Monday game at East Coast and the Wednesday and Thursday games at Balestier Road - after the poll has gone up. For me, the more important question when a player puts his name down for three games a week over a fortnight, and then plays maybe one game in that time, is whether there is sufficient "commitment to play", or whether the player is merely reserving or "choping" a place for himself before the places fill up and until he decides whether he actually wants to play. Once the team selector/captain poll goes up, we are in game mode, and withdrawals after that can be disruptive to the poll, which is an important part of the pre-game process. As the payment information goes up at the same time as the poll, withdrawals after that does also mean extra work for me. As I accept that players may have to withdraw for a variety of reasons, I take it in my stride, within the parameters of the system we have in place. However, if a player is repeatedly withdrawing after the poll goes up, and in a month plays only once for every three or more post-poll withdrawals, then I have to ask if they are taking the commitment to play seriously enough. I suppose the only way to answer that is to keep track of post-poll withdrawals. I will start doing so from next month. More troublesome, and worrisome, than repeated post-poll withdrawals would be g roup withdrawals. Players sometimes put their names down for a game as a group of 2 to 7 players. They could just as easily withdraw as a group of 2 or more players, for example, if they want to play together in some other game which they think will be more challenging or exciting. However, such large scale withdrawals can decimate a game, even if it is more than 4.5 hours before the game, for which there is no penalty. Therefore, if a group of 2 or more players withdraw together, the penalties should kick in earlier. I am thinking along the following lines: | $1 penalty per player | $2 penalty per player | $3 penalty per player | price per player less $6 | | Single player | 4.5 to 3 hours | 3 to 1.5 hours | 1.5 hours to 40 minutes | Less than 40 minutes | | Group of 2 | 5.5 to 3.5 hours | 3.5 to 2 hours | 2 hours to 1 hour | Less than 1 hour | | Group of 3 | 6.5 to 4.5 hours | 4.5 to 2.5 hours | 2.5 hours to 1 | Less than 1 hour | | Group of 4 | 7.5 to 5 hours | 5 to 3 hours | 3 hours to 1.5 hours | Less than 1.5 hours | | Group of 5 | 9 to 6.5 hours | 6.5 to 4 hours | 4 hours to 2 hours | Less than 2 hours | | Group of 6 | 10.5 to 7.5 hours | 7.5 to 5 hours | 5 hours to 2.5 hours | Less than 2.5 hours | | Group of 7 or more | 12 to 9 hours | 9 to 6 hours | 6 hours to 3 hours | Less than 3 hours |
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Post by Rajiv on Mar 5, 2014 9:00:20 GMT 8
From the "Days, times & locations" thread: Brendan contacted me a couple of weeks ago to say that Elvin was giving up the Monday night slot on a big pitch at The Grandstand, and asked whether I could bring the game under GIFFA. As this is an existing game, with several players who play in our games at The Grandstand at the weekends, I'm ok with adding it to the GIFFA Schedule. The GIFFA System and the GIFFA Playing Rules & Principles will apply. As there is hardly any overlap between the players who play at The Grandstand and those who play at East Coast, it should not affect the Monday night game at East Coast. The two games will have separate schedule threads. I will start on 6 January 2014, after The Premier Pitch @ The Grandstand re-opens after refurbishment. With two games on Monday night, I hope that those who are keen on the Monday night game at The Grandstand will make an effort to get enough players. If both games are slow to fill up, my focus will remain on the East Coast game, as it is currently the only game at East Coast each week. .... .... I'll resume scheduling the Monday night game at The Grandstand from 17 February 2014 onwards. If there is significant interest, I will continue beyond March 2014 until perhaps May 2014. If the game hasn't taken off by then, I'll give it a break. The games at Balestier Road on Wednesdays and Thursdays have been filling up well, with a lot of players on waitlist. I will try adding a Sunday night (8 to 9 pm) game at Balestier Road from 23 February 2014 onwards. .... .... There was no one down for the Monday night game at The Grandstand on 17 February 2014, so it was cancelled. Rainer took over the booking for 24 February 2014. No one down for the game at The Grandstand tomorrow (Monday), so it's cancelled as well. I haven't tried the Sunday night game at Balestier Road yet, mainly because I've been busy with all the recent changes in the GIFFA system and on this forum. I will start next Sunday (9 March 2014). For now, I will alternate weekly between a Sunday night game at Balestier Road and a Monday night game at The Grandstand, so for the rest of this month: - Sunday, 9 March 2014, 8 to 9 pm, Balestier Road.
- Monday, 17 March 2014, 9 to 10 pm, The Grandstand.
- Sunday, 23 March 204, 8 to 9 pm, Balestier Road.
- Monday, 31 March 2014, 9 to 10 pm, The Grandstand.
Apart from a few names down for the first two weeks ( 6 January 2014 and 13 January 2014), there have been no names put down for the Monday night game at The Grandstand. In fact, even the weekend games at The Grandstand have not been filling up, and we've gone ahead 7-a-side (instead of the usual 8-a-side) several times since the start of February 2014: A sharp contrast to the situation in the first half of 2013, when the Saturday game often filled up within a day or two of being put up on the schedule board, and as fast as within half an hour! I understand that several regulars are injured or ill, but it does not entirely explain the significant drop in numbers, especially for the Saturday game. We've even had newer players making up numbers for the Saturday game. When the Saturday game was filling up fast, it was difficult for the regulars to introduce guests. If you have guests whom you wish introduce to the Saturday game, now is the time, when the take up is slower. As stated above, the games at Balestier Road have been filling up much better. For the game last Wednesday (26 February 2014), we still had 14 despite a total of 15 withdrawals. I believe that is a record number of withdrawals for any one game. We previously had 12 withdrawals for Monday night game at East Coast (on 21 October 2013), which left us with 10 players, and the game being cancelled. After filling the places up following several withdrawals for that Wednesday game: Constantly amazed at how Rajiv pulls out players from his magic hat  My response: Although our pool of players has grown, it still depends on how many are available to play. The Monday night game at East Coast has also been filling up well over the few weeks, especially when Sean Luo and his recently introduced friends have joined the game. The fluctuations in numbers may well also be seasonal, with a lot of people making an effort to get fit after the indulgences of the Chinese New Year. Also, there are a lot more players playing 11-a-side at the weekends in the early part of the year. This can impact on our games in two ways - fewer players for our weekend games, and more players looking for weeknight games in order to work on their fitness for their weekend 11-a-side game. However, if a group of such players join our games, they have to accept that they may be split up between the two teams. I have added the following under the "Filling places & withdrawals" section of the "GIFFA System" thread: .... .... If a group of more than 4 is put down for a game in circumstances which suggest they only want to play on the same team, I will ask each of the group if that is the case, and those of them who confirm that to be the case may be moved to waitlist until either the team selector/captain poll is put up or closes. .... The "Team Selection" section under the "Guidelines On Team Selection, Organization & Game Play" also provides: .... .... - If one or both teams are built around a group of friends, the remaining players should be split between the two teams in such a way as to make the teams as evenly matched as possible. It should be borne in mind that a team with players who are very familiar with each other or complement each other is likely to have a strength over and above their individual strengths. If is not possible to make the two teams fairly even, then it is advisable not to use such groups of friends as the basis for the two teams (unless the group agrees to play with a handicap, such as the other team having an extra player from the waitlist, or, if there are no players on waitlist, the players being split in such a way so that the other team has 2 players extra).
....
Choices that players have to make. On a separate note, from above: By and large most players have observed the rules of the game in both form and spirit. However there have been more than the odd incident of players withdrawing late on the day of the game but keeping within the rules so as to avoid the penalties. While it can be argued that this should pose no significant issues to an occurrence of a game, in reality it can become a source of irritation to players who have signed up for the game, only for it to be cancelled on the day of the game due to late withdrawals (albeit within the permitted timeframe of 4(?) hours) and insufficient players on the waitlist to fill the void. On a few occasions there have been last minute scrambles to get players to fill in so that the game could go ahead. I think we can all accept the occasional late withdrawals by players due to health reasons, injury, work and family commitments. The key word here has to be "occasional". When it becomes a habit and repeated week after week, we then have a question on the level of commitment to play by these players. I therefore strongly feel that these players who cannot ascertain whether they would be playing due to recurring personal commitments or reasons, should put themselves on a waitlist. This is hard to enforce since the burden is on the player to exercise his discretion and consideration and unexpected events do crop up at the last minute. The mitigating factor is therefore the frequency of occurrence. In addition to the above I would like to propose that players who due to personal commitments withdraws on the day of the game for 2 consecutive weeks will only be allowed to put his name on the waitlist the following week regardless of whether he is committed to play or not. Alternatively we can impose a fine on players who withdraws on the last day consecutively for 3 weeks in a row. The period from 30 hours before the game onwards is now covered by pre-game protocols. For me, a withdrawal is ordinarily not late unless it is made 4.5 hours or less before the game. .... .... Anecdotal accounts and impressions ... are not reliable. .... For me, the more important question when a player puts his name down for three games a week over a fortnight, and then plays maybe one game in that time, is whether there is sufficient "commitment to play", or whether the player is merely reserving or "choping" a place for himself before the places fill up and until he decides whether he actually wants to play. Once the team selector/captain poll goes up, we are in game mode, and withdrawals after that can be disruptive to the poll, which is an important part of the pre-game process. As the payment information goes up at the same time as the poll, withdrawals after that does also mean extra work for me. As I accept that players may have to withdraw for a variety of reasons, I take it in my stride, within the parameters of the system we have in place. However, if a player is repeatedly withdrawing after the poll goes up, and in a month plays only once for every three or more post-poll withdrawals, then I have to ask if they are taking the commitment to play seriously enough. I suppose the only way to answer that is to keep track of post-poll withdrawals. I will start doing so from next month. .... under the "Information on Player Lists" post stickied on the "Player Lists Updates & Playing Records" board to monitor late withdrawals and no shows. I will use the same table to monitor post-poll withdrawals. Again, on a separate note, from the "GIFFA system & playing rules" thread: I have changed it to read: .... The restriction on guests may be relaxed in very exceptional circumstances. .... |
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Post by Rajiv on Mar 31, 2014 15:31:50 GMT 8
From above: And from the "GIFFA values, principles & standards" thread: .... .... There are penalties for late withdrawals and no shows. However, provided the withdrawal is not late, there are currently no consequences for repeatedly withdrawing after the team selector/captain poll goes up. From the same post as above: The game last Sunday (16 March 2014) at The Grandstand was left at risk when 3 post-poll withdrawals left us with 12. We just about got back to 14, to enable to game to go on. For the game at Balestier Road this Thursday (20 March 2014), we had 7 post-poll withdrawals, which left us with 8 players. Although we gradually got back to 14 by 5.33 pm over the course of Thursday, as Zakaria said on the WhatsApp group chat, large number of post-poll withdrawals are disruptive, not just for me and the system, but for the other players as well, who suddenly find that a game that looked certain to go on is no longer a certainty. The issue for me with repeated post poll withdrawals is one of "choping" a place, without any commitment to play. A couple of post-poll withdrawals were avoided today for the game tomorrow (Sunday) at The Grandstand. Like I said, I accept that players who are committed to play may have to withdraw due to other circumstances, and as long as they let me know early enough (at least 4.5 hours before the game), we should be able to find a replacement. However, it can create difficulties when significant numbers withdraw less than 30 hours before the game. It is even more of an issue that certain players repeatedly withdraw less than 30 hours before a game, thus pushing up the number of withdrawals for certain games. Therefore, from April 2014 onwards, I will monitor the number of post-poll withdrawals over a rolling 4 weeks period. Any player who withdraws post-poll 4 times or more over that period can only go on waitlist in the following week, up to the time the poll goes up. Late withdrawals will be excluded as there are separate penalties for that. .... It's not as bad as we might have imagined, perhaps in part, because I have been monitoring. Immediately after I put up the poll, I create the WhatsApp group chat. When there have been several post-poll withdrawals, a few are immediately after the WhatsApp group chat is created. Circumstances can vary, for example: - A player puts his name down even though he is not sure yet whether he can play, thinking he will withdraw if he later finds he cannot play. Being added to the WhatsApp group chat reminds him to withdraw.
- A player puts the name of another down together with his as they have an understanding they will play together in the same game. Sometimes, the other player doesn't even know he has been put down for the game until he is added to the WhatsApp group chat. As he didn't intend to play, he withdraws.
- A player puts his name down expecting to play, but unexpected circumstances arise, and he has to withdraw.
In the first two examples, there isn't a genuine or sufficient commitment to play, and shouldn't arise. Only in the third example is the withdrawal entirely excusable. Some players put their names down fast to reserve a place for themselves even when they don't know whether they can play, especially for more popular games. For example, at the time they put their name down, they may not have recovered from an earlier injury, or may have some other engagement that clashes with the game, but hope to have recovered from the injury, or to be able to change or cancel the other engagement. If the player is reasonably sure he will recover from the injury in time, or can change or cancel the other engagement, then fine. But if it is merely a possibility and a hope, then it is better the player wait before putting his name down, even if it means the places fill up, and he has to go on waitlist. From next month onwards, I will apply the following where a player's name is put down within the first 48 hours after the schedule thread goes up, but withdraws after the WhatsApp group chat is created (30 hours or less before the game):
- If he provides a valid reason for his withdrawal, I will let it pass. A valid reason is one that did not exist when he put his name down, and is beyond the player's control.
- If there is no valid reason, I will keep a record of the withdrawal on a spreadsheet on Google Docs for 4 weeks (post-poll withdrawal with no valid reason provided).
- If a player has 4 or more entries on the spreadsheet over those 4 weeks, in the following week, he may be restricted to the waitlist until 30 hours before game.
- If the player comes in as a replacement for another player withdrawing post-poll, the last entry will be deleted.
- If the player comes in as a replacement for a late withdrawal, the last two entries will be deleted.
It's a matter of give and take.
Like I said above, a couple of post-poll withdrawals per game is not an issue. However, it is a significant problem when a host of players withdraw post-poll, so my aim is to reduce the number of post-poll withdrawals, especially for more popular games, and by those who do it frequently.
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Post by Rajiv on Mar 31, 2014 20:56:25 GMT 8
From above: .... Some players put their names down fast to reserve a place for themselves even when they don't know whether they can play, especially for more popular games. .... .... ..., a couple of post-poll withdrawals per game is not an issue. However, it is a significant problem when a host of players withdraw post-poll, so my aim is to reduce the number of post-poll withdrawals, especially for more popular games, and by those who do it frequently. Currently, the Wednesday night game at Balestier Road is the most popular. The Saturday evening game at The Grandstand, which from November 2012 to June 2013 was by far the most popular game, has barely been filling up on the forum since the start of the year. The Monday night game at East Coast, which at various times has been the second most popular game, has required some effort to fill up of late. The Thursday night game at Balestier Road also requires some effort to fill up, and with a lot of different non-regular players taking up places from week to week, it is difficult to predict how the game will turn out. The pool of players for the Tuesday night game at Kallang is smaller than for the other venues, with fewer players wanting to play 5-a-side and at The Cage, so if several of the regulars are unavailable, we struggle to get to 10. It hasn't helped that since Ian has been out with an injury he picked up in the game on Tuesday, 11 February 2014, there hasn't been a report on the Tuesday game at Kallang. The Sunday evening game at The Grandstand has been struggling since early last year, but more so this year: - Three games cancelled at the turn of the year due to insufficient players. I don't know if the switch to an uncovered pitch while the covered pitch was re-surfaced was a factor, but it the Saturday games went on as usual on the uncovered pitch.
- The games on 16 and 23 March 2014 went ahead with the minimum number (14), so they were 7-a-side.
- The game yesterday (30 March 2014) was stuck on 5 on Friday morning. Although I made an effort to fill up the places, and we managed to get to 16 in the end, there were many new, newer or non-regular players. In fact, the games for much of the year so far have been slow to fill, and have required some, if not a lot, of effort.
It's hard to believe that on several occasions between December 2011 and June 2012, we had back to back games on Sundays at The Grandstand, one from 4 to 5 pm and the second from 5 to 6 pm. Before that, in July 2010, we had back to back games from 5 to 6 pm and 6 to 7 pm. Keeping the Sunday evening game at The Grandstand has required a fair amount of work over the weekend. From earlier in this thread: .... With numbers for last Sunday's game stuck on 12, there was some discussion on the WhatsApp group chat about complacency. If we don't have at least 14 by Saturday, I actually message about 100 players on Friday or Saturday. If we are still short on Sunday, I message again, largely the same 100 players but some other more remote possibilities. I wouldn't call that complacent. The problem is several players wait until Sunday before deciding to play, or can only be sure of their availability on Sunday itself. Often, the players who have come in on the Sunday afternoon had been messaged twice, once on Friday or Saturday, and again on Sunday. Bearing that in mind, I sometimes wonder whether it is worth my while messaging before Saturday evening. .... This is still often the case. Also from above: .... .... I'll resume scheduling the Monday night game at The Grandstand from 17 February 2014 onwards. If there is significant interest, I will continue beyond March 2014 until perhaps May 2014. If the game hasn't taken off by then, I'll give it a break. The games at Balestier Road on Wednesdays and Thursdays have been filling up well, with a lot of players on waitlist. I will try adding a Sunday night (8 to 9 pm) game at Balestier Road from 23 February 2014 onwards. .... .... There was no one down for the Monday night game at The Grandstand on 17 February 2014, so it was cancelled. Rainer took over the booking for 24 February 2014. No one down for the game at The Grandstand tomorrow (Monday), so it's cancelled as well. I haven't tried the Sunday night game at Balestier Road yet, mainly because I've been busy with all the recent changes in the GIFFA system and on this forum. I will start next Sunday (9 March 2014). For now, I will alternate weekly between a Sunday night game at Balestier Road and a Monday night game at The Grandstand, so for the rest of this month: - Sunday, 9 March 2014, 8 to 9 pm, Balestier Road.
- Monday, 17 March 2014, 9 to 10 pm, The Grandstand.
- Sunday, 23 March 204, 8 to 9 pm, Balestier Road.
- Monday, 31 March 2014, 9 to 10 pm, The Grandstand.
Apart from a few names down for the first two weeks ( 6 January 2014 and 13 January 2014), there have been no names put down for the Monday night game at The Grandstand. .... Hardly anyone put their names down, but it really wasn't surprising as I didn't make any effort, and players won't try a new game without a lot of canvassing on my part. I would rather give the Sunday evening game at The Grandstand a rest and make an effort to get the two new games going. What I plan to do is not schedule the Sunday evening at The Grandstand for the whole of April 2014, and instead schedule both the Sunday night game at Balestier Road and the Monday night game at The Grandstand. Those who want a second game at The Grandstand still have it, on Monday night, and better spaced from the other game on Saturday, so players can play both games if they want. It also means that we now have a weeknight game at The Grandstand. And we get a weekend game at a venue besides The Grandstand. While trying to fill up the Sunday evening game at The Grandstand over the past couple of years, I have become aware that there are players who would otherwise play on Sunday who find The Grandstand too far from them. It also means that the Sunday game is at a cooler time of day. The heat at 5 pm is a factor, even on the covered pitch. I was thinking this even before I made the effort to fill up yesterday's game, but the outcome of the game has helped me make up my mind. There may also be other factors behind the fall in numbers for the Sunday evening game at The Grandstand. Somewhat speculative, but I think they include the following:
All in all, a good time for the Sunday evening game at The Grandstand to take a break. I will put up the schedule thread for both the Sunday night game at Balestier Road and the Monday night game at The Grandstand a day earlier than usual. Too late to be a day early for the Sunday game, which in any event goes up tomorrow morning, but I will do so from the Monday game onwards, which will also go up tomorrow morning as well. |
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Post by Marko on Apr 8, 2014 14:56:35 GMT 8
.... You guys must really like the Monday game - my $15 offer was not taken up  Kelvin messaged me at 4.34 pm yesterday to say he would sponsor the next game for anyone giving up their place for him. I messaged the WhatsApp group chat at 4.37 pm to say that you were offering money for a place. Apart from Marko messaging me to ask how much, no one else responded. I asked Marko to contact you directly, but you said he didn't. I guess he wasn't really interested in giving up his place, just trying to establish a market price for a place. I'd be interested to know too, for popular games. Kelvin only messaged me the offer of $15 at about 5 pm, but I was away from my computer by then, and only saw it much later; too late to do anything about it. 1. I was merely curious to know Kelvin is offering $15 plus on top of the game he is paying which works out to be $25 net cost that game? Or a 5 dollar bonus ($15-$10) = $5.00 2. Rajiv, is this considered as late withdrawal if offer comes after stipulated time? |
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Post by Rajiv on Apr 8, 2014 15:11:34 GMT 8
From above: .... 2. Rajiv, is this considered as late withdrawal if offer comes after stipulated time? The "Payments & penalties" section of the GIFFA System thread provides states: .... .... If not less than half an hour before the game, a player offers up his place to those on the waitlist, I will not treat it as a withdrawal, as long as the player remains available if no one on waitlist is still available. .... |
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Post by Rajiv on May 17, 2014 16:23:51 GMT 8
From above: .... ..., even the weekend games at The Grandstand have not been filling up, and we've gone ahead 7-a-side (instead of the usual 8-a-side) several times since the start of February 2014: .... A sharp contrast to the situation in the first half of 2013, when the Saturday game often filled up within a day or two of being put up on the schedule board, and as fast as within half an hour! .... ..., the games at Balestier Road have been filling up much better. .... Although the Saturday evening game at The Grandstand still fills up quickly, usually within a day or two of the schedule thread being put up on Monday morning, the days of it regularly filling up within 2 or 3 hours (between November 2012 and May 2013, and within half an hour for the game on 30 March 2013!) are long gone (although you never know when they might come back). At that time, I considered (in March 2013) back to back slots from 5 to 6 and 6 to 7 pm, and (in April or May 2013) trying three teams over two hours, to accommodate greater numbers. In the end, the only changes that were introduced were: The game that has been filling up very fast of late is the Wednesday night game at Balestier Road. Over the past 2 months, the following Wednesday games have filled within half a day: - The game on 12 March 2014, within 8 hours. 2 out of 3 left on waitlist.
- The game on 19 March 2014, in half a day. 2 out of 5 left on waitlist.
- The game on 2 April 2014, within 4 hours. After having 3 on waitlist, we had one place available on the day of the game.
- 9 April 2014, in about 3 hours. After having 5 on waitlist, and 2 more coming in later on, only 1 didn't get to play.
- 16 April 2014, in about half an hour. 2 out of 6 were left on the waitlist.
- 23 April 2014, in just over an hour. 4 out of 7 left on waitlist.
- 30 April 2014, within 4 hours. Despite a further 5 names, with withdrawals, a further 4 places became available after the team selector poll was put up, including one after line ups went up.
- 7 May 2014, within 3.5 hours. 1 out of 7"]=http://giffas.proboards.com/post/39736/thread]7 left on waitlist.
- 14 May 2014, in just over 7 hours. None of the 4 on waitlist were left.
The coming Wednesday, 21 May 2014, within 3.5 hours. A day later (4 days before the game), there are already 6 on waitlist.
There are two issues with games filling up so fast. Firstly, there is a mad rush to put names down for the game. Sometimes, the rush is to "chope" a place, and not necessarily a commitment to play. Secondly, there is the risk of a lot more withdrawals, as players who have merely choped a place decide on their availability closer to the game. As I've said before: .... For me, a game filling up by the second day after the schedule thread is put up is too fast. You get players rushing to put their names down, and then withdrawals as you get closer to the game, which makes for much volatility and uncertainty, and can be a barrier to playing for less regular players. .... From the schedule thread for the game on 7 May 2014: .... .... What happens when we have 21 signups ?  Withdrawals will bring it back closer to 14.  Said partly in jest, but accurate.  Previously (in November 2010), when there was a mad rush for the Sunday evening game at The Grandstand, I introduced restrictions on putting names down for others for the first time. When there was a mad rush for the Tuesday night game at East Coast, with a correspondingly high degree of volatility due to withdrawals, in September/October 2012, I switched the Tuesday night game at East Coast with the Monday night at Kallang (which was frequently cancelled due to insufficient players), and both games benefitted. Restrictions on putting names down for others are still in place, and switching the Balestier Road game on Wednesday night with a night game at another venue (Monday night at East Coast or Tuesday night at Kallang) isn't an option. Apart from being disruptive to another regular game, there is no availability of a pitch at Khalsa on Monday or Tuesday night. Most of the options considered for the Saturday evening game at The Grandstand as described above don't apply or are difficult to apply to the Wednesday night game at Balestier Road. Playing with three teams over 2 hours from 9 to 11 pm, or having back to back games from 9 to 10 pm and 10 to 11 pm will be more difficult on a weeknight, with players coming from work, and having to work the following day. Also, my view remains that playing three teams over 2 hours is the exception for GIFFA. Putting the schedule thread up one day earlier (Thursday instead of Wednesday) won't make any difference. I haven't ruled out restricting the number of names in the first 48 hours to 2, but not just now. One remaining option is adjusting the payment per player. When there were two night games at East Coast on Tuesday and Thursday each week, and the Tuesday game was filling up very fast, while the Thursday game was a struggle to fill up, I considered (in September 2011) putting up the payment per player for the Tuesday game by $1 per player, and using it to subsidise the Thursday game by $1 per player. As I've stated before: ... I have two tools for dealing with excessively popular games - price, and opening up a new slot. .... . Also, when I first discussed prepayment: .... In time, changes in price may be used to move demand from more popular games to less popular games. .... From June 2014 onwards, if a game fills up too fast, the payment per player will be increased by $1 in a subsequent week, and the less/least popular game at the same venue will be reduced by $1 the week after, as follows: - If a game fills up within 6 hours of the schedule thread being put up, the payment per player will be increased by $1 the subsequent week. The week after that, the payment per player for the less/least popular game at the same venue will be reduced by $1.
- If a game fills up within 12 hours of the schedule thread being put up two weeks in a row, the payment per player will be increased by $1 the subsequent week. The week after that, the payment per player for the less/least popular game at the same venue will be reduced by $1.
However, if the game for which the payment has been increased by $1 is slow to fill up, after 48 hours, I will reduce the payment to the usual amount. There will also be no reduction the following week for the less/least popular game at the same venue.
Also, as stated above, I will also be monitoring players who take a place within 48 hours, but withdraw after the team selector/captain poll goes up. If a player does so too often, he may be blocked from putting his name down in the first 48 hours for a period of time. And from the schedule thread for the game on 23 April 2014: Can someone give up his spot to me? I will be travelling on Friday for 3 weeks and no football for 3 weeks is too much to bear... .... Rajiv, you want me to test the market rate for your Wednesday night games? You'd have to pay not only the player who gives up his place, but those ahead of you on the waitlist. Could be expensive. If the player wanting the place is the first on waitlist, then the player giving up his place can just swap with him, and take his place on the waitlist. However, as stated above, if the player is not first on waitlist, each of the players ahead of him on the waitlist must agree to swap as well. And if the the "deals" are made after the team selector/captain poll goes up, it's additional work for me, so the player offering to pay will have to pay to me 10% of the total he is paying to the other players ; subject to a minimum of $2. |
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Post by Rajiv on Jun 22, 2014 7:41:06 GMT 8
We were one short all of yesterday morning for the game yesterday evening at The Grandstand. After a player withdrew on Friday night, I asked around extensively but had no takers. As I usually do when we are running short of time, yesterday morning, I asked those playing to see if any of had an additional player to fill the remaining place. At 1.25 pm, Sam messaged the WhatsApp group chat to say he had a friend, Jacob, who could play. At 1.28 pm, Foo Cheong, who had just arrived back from abroad, replied to my earlier WhatsApp broadcast to say he could play. I was having lunch at the time, so I didn't see the messages until about 1.40 pm. By that time, Foo Cheong had also posted on the schedule thread, at 1.36 pm. Foo Cheong would not have been aware of Sam's message on the group chat, and was under the impression that the first to post on the forum would have priority. The system as it currently stands actually does not make provision. Attached is the "Filling places & withdrawals" section of the GIFFA System thread as it currently stands - filling places & withdrawals (140621).pdf (133.98 KB). Foo Cheong may well have been thinking of the first post on the "Filling places & choices" thread, which is as follows: .... You can SMS me if you are unable to access the message board. However, you bear the risk of the places being filled before I get round to putting your name down. I may have repeated this elsewhere, but it is not currently part of the GIFFA System. For yesterday, I put the situation to both players. Foo Cheong was keen to play, and Sam seemed ok with his friend not playing, so I went with priority for the posting on the forum, and Foo Cheong played. Going forward, ordinarily, priority will given based on the time that the player's name is put down on the schedule thread. However, if I am forced to ask around to fill up any remaining places and, in within the last 4.5 hours before the game (after the time that any team selector/captain poll is scheduled to close), two or more players come forward within a short time of each other, I will have absolute discretion to decide who gets the place(s). The factors I will take into account include whether the player is in credit or debit on payments, and giving newer players an opportunity to play. The place is only confirmed when I notify the player who has the place. I will amend the "Filling places & withdrawals" section of the GIFFA System thread accordingly. As Jacob missed out on a game yesterday, I will allow Sam to put him down for one future game even within the first 48 hours. As currently provided under the "Filling places & withdrawals" section: .... The restriction on guests may be relaxed in very exceptional circumstances. .... |
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Post by Foo Cheong on Jul 2, 2014 17:11:36 GMT 8
Foo Cheong may well have been thinking of the first post on the "Filling places & choices" thread, which is as follows: .... You can SMS me if you are unable to access the message board. However, you bear the risk of the places being filled before I get round to putting your name down. I may have repeated this elsewhere, but it is not currently part of the GIFFA System. Yes, I had that in mind. I feel that that priority should be given to those who put their names down on the message board. This encourages participation in the forum and also increases viewership. Putting a name down in a Whatsapp chat means that the information is restricted to only 15 people at most. There could come a day when the majority will be messaging you to sign them up instead of putting their names down for a game. That is more work for you, and less information available on the message board for the others to make an informed decision. |
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Post by Rajiv on Jul 3, 2014 9:50:59 GMT 8
.... I feel that that priority should be given to those who put their names down on the message board. This encourages participation in the forum and also increases viewership. Putting a name down in a Whatsapp chat means that the information is restricted to only 15 people at most. There could come a day when the majority will be messaging you to sign them up instead of putting their names down for a game. That is more work for you, and less information available on the message board for the others to make an informed decision. The priority is ordinarily based on who gets their name down on the forum first. However, if I am forced to ask around to fill a place and we are down to the last few hours before the game, I think it is only fair that I have some discretion who gets the place. By this stage, I would have asked around fairly extensively, so it doesn't matter if the reply is the WhatsApp group chat, by a personal message (whether WhatsApp or SMS), a telephone call, or on the forum. Players who want to ensure priority by putting their names down on the thread would have had ample time to do so in the 5 preceding days, after the schedule thread was first put up. In fact, priorities start to change once the poll is up (a day and a half or less before the game), as those who owe for more than one previous game lose priority, and I can move GIFFA Players ahead of guests on the waitlist. |
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Post by Rajiv on Sept 20, 2014 8:24:35 GMT 8
Having become the most popular game over the course of this year, the game on Wednesday night at Khalsa was cancelled this week (17 September 2014), after we had 13 withdrawals. From above: .... ..., I will ... be monitoring players who take a place within 48 hours, but withdraw after the team selector/captain poll goes up. If a player does so too often, he may be blocked from putting his name down in the first 48 hours for a period of time. .... I haven't been monitoring, as it just adds to the work I have to do. I have deleted Annex 2 to the "Information on Player Groups & Lists" thread on the "Player Groups, Lists, Updates & Playing Records" board, as I haven't updated it since I first added it in March 2014. As addressed above, my concern with games that fill up within a day or two is the risk of a lot of withdrawals after the team selector/captain poll goes up and the WhatsApp group chat is created. The game fills up quickly because it is popular, but players withdraw either because after the reminder of being added to the WhatsApp group chat, they realise they can't play after all, and sometimes, after a few of the regulars withdraw, some of those remaining feel the game isn't going to be as good as they expected, and withdraw as well. As I have said several times before: Merely "choping" a place in a more popular game doesn't fit in with either. If a game fills up within 48 hours, and remains full until I create the WhatsApp group chat, I am considering two options for anyone who put his name down within the first 48 hours and had a confirmed place when the WhatsApp group chat was created, but subsequently withdraws: - The player will have to pay a $1 penalty for "choping" a place without sufficient commitment to play, unless he provides details of something unexpected that has just arisen as the reason for the withdrawal.
- The player can only be on waitlist until the WhatsApp group chat is created for the following week's game.
I'll come back to this later. I may put up a poll as to which option is preferred.
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Post by Rajiv on Oct 14, 2014 22:23:13 GMT 8
The Monday game at MacPherson and the Tuesday game at Kallang have been cancelled this week and last. For last Monday (6 October 2014), haze was a factor. After getting 14 players, several players either withdrew due to the haze or expressed concerns about playing in the haze, so the game was cancelled. For last Tuesday: Stuck at 4, and I am reluctant to ask around with the haze situation, so best to cancel. We got to 14 for yesterday (Monday, 13 October 2014), but with 4 withdrawals on the day itself, we were left short, even though we managed to get one replacement. For today (Tuesday), we were stuck on 6, so the game was also cancelled. With the Wednesday and Thursday games at Khalsa this week also slow to fill up, I was unsure how much effort to make to fill up the Monday and Tuesday games, especially as I have also been busy with work. I can make a lot of effort, and still not fill the places up, and then I have to put in effort to fill up games later in the week. Frankly, when several games over several days are very slow to fill up, it is better that numbers are consolidated for the games later in that period. Those who are keen to play can still get a game if they are flexible. However, those who only want to play on particular days or at particular venues may lose out. Numbers have always been volatile, but we are going through a period where many former regulars are not playing regularly. I'm not sure if it is because they have found other games to play in, or are busy with other things, but if too many regulars abandon one of our regular games, then unless other regulars or players keen on that game introduce new players, it is likely that that game will be cancelled. There is a limit to my finding replacements from our pool of players, especially at times when several regulars have lost interest, several players are injured or unwell, and many are busy with work or other commitments. All the regular games continue to fill up to half or three-quarters on the forum, some faster than others. However, almost every game is left one to four players short. It is becoming increasingly difficult to fill up those remaining places, as many players become less flexible and accommodating. I normally can fill up 2 to 4 places if I start asking around the day before the game. However, if there is more than one withdrawal on the day of the game, or even one withdrawal in the 4 to 6 hours before the game, it is becoming increasingly difficult to find a replacement. I am increasingly relying on those playing to bring in friends to make up the numbers. Every game can go ahead with two less than the maximum number. This has happened a few times now, especially for the Tuesday game at the Grandstand and the weekend games at The Grandstand. However, unless there is an improvement in the numbers, one or two cancellations each week may become the norm. |
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Post by Rajiv on Jan 29, 2015 14:42:17 GMT 8
Other than the 5-a-side game on Tuesday at The Cage and the 7-a-side game on Thursday at Khalsa, since the start of the year, our other games (which are all 7 or 8-a-side on bigger pitch) having been filling up within a day or two of the schedule thread going up (5 days before the game). However, with withdrawals, there are often places available the day before or on the day of the game, especially for the Wednesday game at Khalsa and Saturday game at The Grandstand, which have taken turns to be the most popular game for some time now. Currently, the Monday game at Macpherson and the Sunday game at The Grandstand are filling up as fast. Although the Thursday game is slower to fill up, it doesn't suffer as much from withdrawals, so we are often left with players on waitlist for that game. Only the Tuesday game at The Cage remains a struggle to fill up. Unfortunately, the Wednesday game this week was cancelled after being reduced to 10 players following 7 withdrawals. The 14 places had initially filled up within 24 hours. As discussed on this thread in February 2014, a game being cancelled as a result of a large number of withdrawals in the 24 hours before the game, despite having filled up fast and having had several players on waitlist, has affected the more popular games before. The popular Wednesday game was previously affected as recently as in September 2014. At that time, I tightened the rules on group withdrawals, and started monitoring post-poll withdrawals. Monitoring added to the work I have to do, so I didn't continue with that. However, the issues remain the same, as described earlier in this thread: .... There are two issues with games filling up so fast. Firstly, there is a mad rush to put names down for the game. Sometimes, the rush is to "chope" a place, and not necessarily a commitment to play. Secondly, there is the risk of a lot more withdrawals, as players who have merely choped a place decide on their availability closer to the game. .... .... A reminder that in putting your name down for a game, there is a degree of commitment to play in that game. Sometimes, the mind is keen, but the body isn't ready (due to uncertainty whether the player will have recovered sufficiently from illness or injury). Sometimes, the body is ready, but the circumstances are not yet in place (due to uncertainty over which game to play in, or personal schedules). If the uncertainty is significant, then the player isn't really in a position to make a commitment, and should hold back on taking up a place. There are always other games in our schedule. However, many players tend to stick with the games they are familiar with. If the player nevertheless wishes to indicate his interest in a particular game, but isn't yet in a position to give sufficient commitment, then he can put himself down on waitlist. Although it doesn't guarantee him a place, if there are still places available the day before the game, I will ask that player first. ..... Also, from earlier in this thread: .... Once the team selector/captain poll goes up, we are in game mode, and withdrawals after that can be disruptive to the poll, which is an important part of the pre-game process. As the payment information goes up at the same time as the poll, withdrawals after that does also mean extra work for me. As I accept that players may have to withdraw for a variety of reasons, I take it in my stride, within the parameters of the system we have in place. However, if a player is repeatedly withdrawing after the poll goes up, and in a month plays only once for every three or more post-poll withdrawals, then I have to ask if they are taking the commitment to play seriously enough. .... I am considering changing the penalties for withdrawals and no shows from the start of the next quarter (that is, from 1 April 2015) as follows: - $1 admin fee for withdrawals (a) less than 24 hours before the game or (b) after the team selector/captain poll goes up (whichever is later for that particular game). However, for each season (April to September, or October to March the following year), $1 will be waived from the first 6 times admin fees are imposed on a particular player. Therefore, only players who repeatedly withdraw less than 24 hours before the game will be affected.
- For late withdrawals (5 hours or less before the game), additionally:
- $1 penalty for withdrawals after the team selector/captain poll closed (usually 5 hours before the game).
- $2 penalty for withdrawals less than 3 hours before the game.
- $3 penalty for withdrawals less than 2 hours before the game.
- $4 penalty for withdrawals less than 1 hour before the game.
- Half the price per person for withdrawals less than half an hour before the game.
- For no shows:
- The price per person less $3 for a no show with good reason given.
- The price per person less $2 for a no show with some reason given.
- The price per person less $1 for a no show with no reason given.
As group withdrawals haven't been an issue, I will do away with different penalties for group withdrawals. |
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Post by Rajiv on Mar 7, 2015 8:53:32 GMT 8
From above: Other than the 5-a-side game on Tuesday at The Cage and the 7-a-side game on Thursday at Khalsa, since the start of the year, our other games (which are all 7 or 8-a-side on bigger pitch) having been filling up within a day or two of the schedule thread going up (5 days before the game). However, with withdrawals, there are often places available the day before or on the day of the game, especially for the Wednesday game at Khalsa and Saturday game at The Grandstand, which have taken turns to be the most popular game for some time now. Currently, the Monday game at Macpherson and the Sunday game at The Grandstand are filling up as fast. Although the Thursday game is slower to fill up, it doesn't suffer as much from withdrawals, so we are often left with players on waitlist for that game. Only the Tuesday game at The Cage remains a struggle to fill up. .... And from the "Weekly schedule & number of games" thread: .... The Tuesday night game at The Cage has continued to be difficult to fill. We only managed to get 10 for the game on 3 February 2015 after a player who ordinarily doesn't play in our 5-a-side games came in later on and brought 2 others after his regular Tuesday night training session for his 11-a-side team was cancelled. The game on 10 February 2015 went ahead fairly smoothly, but the game on 17 February 2015 was switched to a 7-a-side at the SBSA @ Kallang, and the game this week (24 February 2015) was cancelled, stuck on 3 players. On the other hand, other than the two Khalsa games last week being cancelled due to Chinese New Year ( Wednesday, 18 February 2015 being the eve, and Thursday, 19 February 2015 being the first day of the Chinese New Year), all our other games have been filling up fast or with several players on waitlist. Since the Monday game (previously at The Cage @ Kallang) and the Tuesday game (previously at Sports Planet @ East Coast) were switched round in October/November 2012, there have been occasions when Tuesday game at The Cage has filled up well, but mainly it has struggled. It is frustrating that despite all my efforts, it is the only longstanding game that does not regularly fill up on the forum without requiring a lot of asking around on my part. It is clear that most of our regulars prefer playing 7 or 8-a-side on a bigger pitch, and there are many regulars who are not interested in playing 5-a-side on a small pitch. And from the "Days, times & locations" thread: .... On 16 January 2015, we also had our first ever game on a Friday ( excluding public holidays). It was a 5-a-side at The Cage @ Kallang, a standard 9 to 10 pm game. .... The week from 10 to 16 January 2015 was also the first time we had games on every day of the week. For some time now, we have had a standard 6 games scheduled a week. Usually, all 6 go on, but occasionally, a game or two are cancelled due to shortfall in numbers or the weather. .... For now, I will continue to schedule a Friday night 5-a-side game at The Cage @ Kallang. However, the games that fill up fast and have several players on waitlist are the 7-a-side games. .... .... (other than Friday). For March 2015, I will switch the Tuesday game to SBSA @ Kallang, from 9 to 10 pm. There is an issue of whether we should play 6 or 7-a-side there, but it is still a bigger pitch than the The Cage @ Kallang. The game at The Cage will be on Friday. .... We'll see how it goes. and: Rajiv, the Cage regulars were discussing the other day and the consensus was that it would be difficult for most to play on Friday nights. As far as possible, the preference is to keep to Tuesday which has been worked into our routines. Unfortunately, Tuesday night at The Cage only has a handful of regulars. There are others who play from time to time but over several years, even players who may play regularly for a few months then stop for long periods. We do not have a big enough pool of regulars. There is still a regular game on Tuesday night, 9 to 10 pm, at Kallang, except that it is at SBSA instead of The Cage. I hope that some of the players who only want to play on a big pitch give it a try and become regulars, so that the pool is bigger, and the game becomes more sustainable. |
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Post by Rajiv on Jul 30, 2015 18:33:51 GMT 8
From the "Public holidays & seasonal factors" thread: ..., as the international schools and those who follow an international calendar have summer vacations between June and September 2015, numbers don't usually pick up until late August 2015. The Tuesday night game at the Grandstand has been cancelled 3 weeks in a row - 23 June 2015, 30 June 2015, and 7 July 2015. The last occasion was a pity, as we were only one short. The game on Saturday, 11 July 2015, was also cancelled, one short. .... This Friday (17 July 2015) is Hari Raya Puasa. .... .... And from the "Days, times & locations" thread" .... The Premier Pitch @ The Grandstand is not available on Tuesday, 4 August 2015. With several games cancelled over recent weeks, I won't schedule the Tuesday game at the Grandstand again until 11 August 2015. I have 2 hours on a small pitch at Sports Planet @ East Coast which I have to use. I'll schedule the game next Tuesday (21 July 2015) there. . We've had a record low of 18 games this month. Apart from usual seasonal factors, we also had the Puasa month leading up to Hari Raya Puasa, and perhaps people involved in SG50 events.  Apart from the Tuesday night games, the following games were cancelled this month: - Saturday, 11 July 2015, 1 short.
- Thursday, 16 July 2015, eve of long weekend, stuck on 8.
- Saturday, 18 July 2015, long weekend, down to 5.
- Thursday, 23 July 2015, down to 3.
However, numbers have picked up since 24 July 2015, with lots of players on waitlist:
- Saturday, 25 July 2015, 2 left on waitlist.
- Sunday, 26 July 2015, 4 left on waitlist.
- Monday, 27 July 2015, no one left on waitlist.
- Wednesday, 29 July 2015, 6 left on waitlist.
- Tonight (Thursday, 30 July 2015), slow to fill up, but filled up quickly once I asked around, and 3 left on waitlist.
- Saturday, 1 August 2015, currently 3 on waitlist.
- Sunday, 2 August 2015, currently 4 on waitlist.
- Monday, 3 August 2015, already 3 on waitlist.
A total of 25 players on waitlist - that's enough players to fill almost two games on a big pitch!
To accommodate more players, I'll schedule an extra game this Sunday (2 August 2015), 6 to 7 pm, at Khalsa.
As I have pointed out before, if players are flexible enough, they will get a game. I do try to make sure there are enough places.
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