|
|
Post by Rajiv on Sept 6, 2012 10:54:08 GMT 8
I think the fear of players drifting away doesn't take into account the real situation.
We've always had a relatively high turnover of players. I would imagine that up to 50 players have played on a Tuesday night at East Coast this year alone. The number would be a lot higher if you go back to the start of the Tuesday games on a big pitch at East Coast in August 2010.
Players stop playing for a variety of reasons - injury, work and other family/social commitments, wanting to play with other groups or play other sports/games, or just to take a break. Sometimes, players come back after an interval of weeks, months, or even years.
And although the Tuesday game is currently filling up very fast with several reserves, there have been several times this year when the game has been slow to fill up. If I am not mistaken, it has even been cancelled a couple of times.
We have to look at the benefits of switching the Tuesday game to Monday:
* It is better for those who want to play the second game at East Coast on Thursday each week, which would make the second game more sustainable, thus increasing the total number of places at East Coast.
* If the Monday night game fills up as fast the Tuesday night game currently does,, there is the option of reinstating the Tuesday night game in addition to the Monday night game, giving players more choice.
I think alternating from week to week would cause confusion. I would rather just try Monday, and see how it works out over a period of time.
I'm likely to make the decision this weekend. In the meantime, anyone else with views on the matter, feel free to post below.
|
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Sept 10, 2012 11:20:46 GMT 8
Surprisingly, for this week, the Monday night game at Kallang filled up earlier than the Tuesday night game at East Coast. Actually, what is most surprising is that the Tuesday game tomorrow hasn't even filled up yet. I don't know if it is a reaction to the posts above, and if so, whether it is an indication of support for or opposition to a switch to Monday night. In any event, I'll wait a further week or two before making a decision. For Sundays: If we want to continue on a big pitch at Turf City from October 2012 onwards, we will in any event have to use an uncovered pitch as the covered pitches will no longer be available as big pitches. I'm looking at the following: .... * For Sunday, instead of switching immediately, try a month of old-style mini-tournaments on two small covered pitches in October 2012. ..... We almost switched to the uncovered pitch yesterday. Even though there were reservations about the weather, there was a lot of interest in trying it out. In the end, we stuck to the covered big pitch, as that was what the players signed up for, but we'll go ahead with a big uncovered pitch on Sundays from October 2012 onwards. I proposed that weekend games for Nov dec be in sheltered pitches due to rainy season. we can have mini-tournaments.. Chance for us to beef up our fitness .... We can try that between November and January. We'll see how it goes. New venue: I discovered over the weekend that there is an uncovered 7-a-side pitch at Indian Association (further up Balestier Road from Khalsa), run by Kickers Bay. It is cheaper, so it works out to $8 per player. I am keen to try it out. Unfortunately, there is only one 7-a-side pitch there (plus two 5-a-side pitches), and the 7-a-side pitch is only available on weekends, not weeknights. As the covered big pitches at Turf City will no longer be available from October 2012 onwards, I'm looking at moving the Saturday game to Indian Association, instead of the uncovered big pitch at Turf City. The Saturday game hasn't feel filling up as well as the Sunday game, and we only had 14 on Saturday. We need several more for the uncovered big pitch at Turf City ( between 16 to 20). Also, from my observations over the past two years, I think it is less likely to rain in the afternoons in the Balestier area compared to the Bukit Timah area. Having 2 less places on a Saturday will be made up by having 2 to 4 additional places on a Sunday (up to 8 additional places if we end up with mini-tournaments during the rainy season). I will also be scheduling additional games on Sunday and Tuesday night. .... ..., I also have 9 to 10 pm at Khalsa on Sundays from October 2012 onwards. I tried to get 8 to 9 pm, but it is not available. I have the pitch at Indian Association from 8 to 9 pm on Sundays, so the new slot will be there instead of Khalsa. The other new slot is: .... * ... a weeknight game at Turf City. Now that all those using the big pitch are being forced onto the uncovered pitches, I have managed to get a small covered pitch on Tuesday nights from 9 to 10 pm from October 2012 onwards. I can get a big uncovered pitch, but I am concerned we may not have enough players. .... What we could end up with is: * Saturday, 5 to 6 pm, 7-a-side at Indian Association ($8 per player). * Sunday, 5 to 6 pm, 9 or 10-a-side at Turf City. Alternatively, during the rainy season, or if there is heavy rain, a 4-team mini-tournament, 6-a-side, at Turf City (small covered pitch, $11 per player, subject to availability). * Sunday, 8 to 9 pm, 7-a-side at Indian Association ($8 per player). * Monday, 9 to 10 pm, 7-a-side at East Coast. * Tuesday, 9 to 10 pm, 5-a-side at Kallang (covered). * Tuesday, 9 to 10 pm, 6-a-side at Turf City (small covered, $11 per player). * Wednesday, 9 to 10 pm, 7-a-side at Khalsa. * Thursday, 9 to 10 pm, 7-a-side at Khalsa. * Thursday, 9 to 10 pm, 7-a-side at East Coast. All games are on uncovered pitches and are $10 per player unless specified otherwise. All games will go ahead even with 2 less than the maximum number specified (1 less per team). The changes will take place no earlier than the start of October 2012, and some may be delayed for a few weeks. I'll finalize the position in the next week or two. |
|
|
|
Post by Babs on Sept 10, 2012 14:18:03 GMT 8
It would be disappointing to see the Sat game be taken away from Turf City especially without trying out the uncovered pitch for a few weeks first.
|
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Sept 10, 2012 14:27:16 GMT 8
The struggle to get to 16 on Saturdays has been disappointing too. And we will need more for the uncovered pitch at Turf City. And for both Saturday and Sunday. Just too much of a risk.
To compensate, the Saturday game will be $8 per player, almost half of what it currently is, and $2 cheaper than the Sunday game at Turf City. And there is an additional Tuesday night game at Turf City.
|
|
|
|
Post by Foo Cheong on Sept 10, 2012 15:28:39 GMT 8
The Saturday game should remain at Turf City. It is convenient for regulars to switch between Saturdays and Sundays depending on their weekend commitments.
Indian Association's pitch is also 7-a-side, so if trying to get 14 for Turf City is difficult, then it would also be the same for IA. On the other hand, if lescathay 14, can downsize to small pitch at Turf City, and if more than 16, can upsize to uncovered pitch at Turf City. There is no option for this at IA.
|
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Sept 10, 2012 15:41:42 GMT 8
Up to now, the number of players prepared to switch from a big covered pitch to a small covered pitch when short of players has been small. Several of our regulars have stated they don't want to play the small pitch at Turf City, and would rather withdraw or the game be cancelled. You may know who they are. We've only switched from a big covered pitch to a small covered pitch once over the past 3 years, and even then, with a couple of withdrawals. The rest of the time, it is left to me to scramble around to try to find additional players.
I may consider switching a realistic option if the Tuesday night game takes off.
And there is no guarantee we will be able to switch. It is all subject to availability. In fact, the same applies to Indian Association, which also has 5-a-side pitches.
And it is easier to go from 14 to 10 if we are a couple short, than it is to go from 18 or 20 to 12 when we are a couple short.
Please be reminded that the covered pitches at Turf City will no longer be available as big pitches from October 2012 onwards.
|
|
|
|
Post by Foo Cheong on Sept 10, 2012 15:47:27 GMT 8
Turf City still gives the option of upsizing which IA does not.
|
|
PRG Player
|
Post by Fred on Sept 10, 2012 16:37:35 GMT 8
I think there was a seasonal effect to lower numbers in recent saturday games but it was never a problem in the first half of the year.
But as David T mentioned yesterday the bigger uncovered pitch might not be as popular if it brings us closer to the 11-aside format, in which case we need an alternative if we want to play 7 or 8 aside which might suit the biggest number.
We'll probably need a few weeks before we can finalize the venues and schedule.
|
|
|
|
Post by Babs on Sept 10, 2012 18:06:30 GMT 8
As Fred said Sat games never had a problem filling up before until perhaps recently which can be put down to perhaps timing of the year plus a few regulars leaving (Ade, Boris, Dan), and others having injuries or babies (Raminder, Rockstar) but they will return at some point. There is also a new regular crowd forming with the likes of Nick, Steve G, Jake, Anthony, Jon etc playing on more than one occasion. I don't think that 10 players are needed for the big pitch, that would be overkill & unnecessary. 9 a side would work just fine there which is only 1 player more each side than the current max we have at Turf City. You could probably get away with 8 a side on there like we do with 7 a side at times on current Turf City pitches. Aside from that, it's a great social spot for Sat'days esp with the Pub down the road  |
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Sept 10, 2012 18:56:13 GMT 8
Numbers for Saturdays drop away every few months. There are periods when the game fills up fast, and we have reserves, and other periods when we struggle to get to even 14. Bottom line is that I am reluctant to switch both the Saturday and Sunday game to the bigger uncovered pitch at the same time, especially as we approach the rainy season. I am planning to do the Sunday one first, and to keep the Saturday one on a smaller 7-a-side pitch. If the Saturday game persistently has reserves, then we can still switch it to the bigger uncovered pitch at Turf City later. As for pubs, see it as an opportunity to try out spots in the Thomson/Newton area on your way home from Balestier. |
|
|
|
Post by Foo Cheong on Sept 10, 2012 21:47:24 GMT 8
As for pubs, see it as an opportunity to try out spots in the Thomson/Newton area on your way home from Balestier. The girls in Bukit Timah are prettier. Babs can attest to that. |
|
PRG Player
|
Post by Fred on Sept 11, 2012 9:42:26 GMT 8
If the Saturday game persistently has reserves, then we can still switch it to the bigger uncovered pitch at Turf City later. The number of reserves is a bad predictor of the potential number of players. Those who expressed their view are in favour of maintaining the saturday game at TC, but we haven't heard from Sunday regulars, so why not the othe way around? |
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Sept 11, 2012 11:06:44 GMT 8
Because the current issue of filling up the Saturday game goes all the way back to the start of July 2012? The Sunday game has generally been easier to fill up during the same period (although we haven't had back-to-back games on Sunday since June 2012). I know the fact that we only got to 15 last Saturday, while we've had 2 to 4 reserves for the last two Sundays is too short a period to extrapolate from, but the trend since July 2012 is a much longer term outlook. We even ended up with a 5-a-side on a small pitch on Saturday, 4 August 2012. If, to start with, I'm looking to keep one of the two weekend games as 7 or 8-a-side (even if it means moving to Balestier) and one at 9 or 10-a-side on the uncovered pitch at Turf City, which should it be? I think the numbers speak for themselves. I know there are several Saturday regulars who have been away or injured, but the same applies to Sunday. If anything, it is a reason to keep one at 7 or 8-a-side to start with. By the way, Foo Cheong plays both, so it's just 2 Saturday regulars. Of course I'd like to hear what the others have to say, but I find that players only speak up if they are strongly opposed to something. I assume the rest are willing to give it a try. I expect Jye will now add his voice. |
|
|
|
Post by Boon Yick on Sept 11, 2012 16:46:33 GMT 8
I am for switching East Coast to Monday to try it out. Always good to kick off the week with an exercise.
|
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Sept 13, 2012 11:01:21 GMT 8
.... There will also no longer be the option of having an extra game from 4 to 5 pm on Sunday at Turf City. .... What we could end up with is: .... * Sunday, 8 to 9 pm, 7-a-side at Indian Association ($8 per player). .... .... I know it's short notice, but I'm willing to try from this Sunday onwards. As an extra incentive for this new game, I'll give $1 off for this Sunday, so it will be $7 per player, half the price of a game on a covered big pitch at Turf City. The decision on switching the East Coast game from Tuesday night to Monday night will be made within the week. |
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Sept 17, 2012 21:45:07 GMT 8
The extra Sunday game last night didn't work out - I guess it will take some time before players get used to a new slot. .... I'll try again next week. It should be seen in the same way as our other weeknight games - playing the night before a working day. Except that all our weeknight games are 9 to 10 pm, to allow players to get to the game in time after finishing a day's work, while the Sunday night game is scheduled for 8 to 9 pm, as Sunday itself is not a working day. However, if players feel 9 to 10 pm on Sunday would work better, please let me know. I put up the thread for the game late last week, as I only decided to go ahead with it at a late stage, but from this week onwards, I will put up the thread one day earlier, that is, on Monday. The Tuesday night game at East Coast for this week filled up faster than ever - within 2 hours of the schedule thread being posted last Thursday. We had 6 reserves by Friday night. .... Amongst other things, I am looking to move the Tuesday night game at East Coast to Monday night. Currently, the Tuesday night game fills up on the day it is put up, that is, Thursday, or by the following day, and there are several reserves. On the other hand, the Monday night game at Kallang struggles to fill up. It is frustrating that the Tuesday night game, with 14 places available, fills up, and has several reserves, much earlier than the Monday night game, with only 10 places to fill. The system works better if the earlier game fills up first. It appears to be the venue that is more popular than the day of the week, so it would make sense to move the East Coast game to Monday night. Also, by having a longer gap between the first East Coast game, and the second one on Thursday, more players are likely to play twice a week, which would give the Thursday night game at East Coast greater consistency. This is of course subject to availability. If the East Coast game is moved from Tuesday to Monday, the Monday night game at Kallang will be moved to later in the week. I am looking at making the changes as early as October 2012, .... .... Playing both games at ECP on a regular basis, the longer recovery period does help in my personal opinion. I am for switching East Coast to Monday to try it out. Always good to kick off the week with an exercise. , presumably to try to give that game greater consistency. The Tuesday game at East Coast will be switched to Monday nights with effect from 24 September 2012, until at least the end of the year. If the game continues to fill up within a day, I may have both a Monday and Tuesday night game at East Coast in the new year. A few players expressed concern that the regular pool of players may dissipate if the game is switched. I think the fear of players drifting away doesn't take into account the real situation. We've always had a relatively high turnover of players. I would imagine that up to 50 players have played on a Tuesday night at East Coast this year alone. The number would be a lot higher if you go back to the start of the Tuesday games on a big pitch at East Coast in August 2010. Players stop playing for a variety of reasons - injury, work and other family/social commitments, wanting to play with other groups or play other sports/games, or just to take a break. Sometimes, players come back after an interval of weeks, months, or even years. And although the Tuesday game is currently filling up very fast with several reserves, there have been several times this year when the game has been slow to fill up. If I am not mistaken, it has even been cancelled a couple of times. We have to look at the benefits of switching the Tuesday game to Monday: * It is better for those who want to play the second game at East Coast on Thursday each week, which would make the second game more sustainable, thus increasing the total number of places at East Coast. * If the Monday night game fills up as fast the Tuesday night game currently does,, there is the option of reinstating the Tuesday night game in addition to the Monday night game, giving players more choice. .... On the other hand, I won't move the game at Kallang from Monday to Tuesday night until 9 October 2012. The Monday night game at Kallang has filled up reasonably well over the last couple of weeks. Hopefully, the switch won't affect numbers significantly. Therefore, the situation from Sunday night to Tuesday night over the next few weeks will be as follows: * Sunday, 23 September 2012 - 7-a-side at Indian Association * Monday, 24 September 2012 - 7-a-side at East Coast + 5-a-side at Kallang (24 places, but the pool of players for East Coast and Kallang are fairly separate). * Tuesday, 25 September 2012 - no game. * Sunday, 30 September 2012 - 7-a-side at Indian Association * Monday, 1 October 2012 - 7-a-side at East Coast + 5-a-side at Kallang (24 places, but the pool of players for East Coast and Kallang are fairly separate). * Tuesday, 2 October 2012 - 5/6-a-side on a small covered pitch at Turf City. * Sunday, 7 October 2012 - 7-a-side at Indian Association * Monday, 8 October 2012 - 7-a-side at East Coast * Tuesday, 9 October 2012 - 5/6-a-side on a small covered pitch at Turf City + 5-a-side at Kallang (22 places, but the pool of players for Turf City and Kallang are fairly separate). The schedule for Sunday night to Tuesday night will then continue that way until the end of the year. The rest of the games, including the Sunday evening game at Turf City, are unaffected, except that I have given up the extra 4 to 5 pm slot on Sundays at Turf City. The extra slots on Sunday nights at IA, and Tuesday nights at Turf City (from October 2012 onwards), compensate for that to some extent. |
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Sept 30, 2012 22:29:42 GMT 8
Both the Thursday games were cancelled due to rain. It only started raining at both venues (Khalsa and East Coast) about 10 to 20 minutes before 9 pm, the scheduled time for the games. .... To make things worse: * I had started the process of switching the Monday and Tuesday games by moving the Tuesday night game at East Coast to Monday night, so, plus the Monday night game at Kallang, we had 2 games on Monday night, but no game on Tuesday night. * The Wednesday night game at Khalsa was cancelled for the first time in ages, as there was only 1 name down as at Tuesday morning. When I cancelled the Wednesday game, I said: .... I'll try to make sure the Thursday game at Khalsa goes ahead. Although we had a reserve for East Coast, we struggled to fill the Khalsa game on Thursday, even with 2 visitors from Belgium. With three late withdrawals, we needed at least 1 more. Having played on Monday at Kallang as well: .... .... Worst comes to worst, I'll play in goal. I played last night with some friends, and I am too old to be playing three times in a week.  Can't wait forever for the last player for Khalsa, so I'll play. .... .... It wasn't meant to be. It also meant we only had 2 weeknight games, both on Monday, with no further game until Saturday. Games per week since 25 August 2012: * 25 to 30 August 2012: The basic 6 games, with the Thursday night game at East Coast. However, the Thursday game was badly affected by Sports Planet screwing up the booking. * 1 to 6 September 2012: The basic 6 games, with the Thursday night game at Khalsa. * 8 to 13 September 2012: The basic 6 games, with the Thursday night game at Khalsa. * 15 to 20 September 2012: 7 games, with two games on Thursday night, at both Khalsa and East Coast. * 22 to 27 September 2012: 4 games, with only 2 midweek games, both on Monday. No game scheduled on Tuesday, the Wednesday night game cancelled due to insufficient players and both Thursday night games cancelled due to heavy rain. Difficulties do seem to affect Thursday night games more. Even previously. I've been keeping a record of games per week (initially just for weeknight games) on this thread since February/March 2012, roughly on a monthly basis. From next month onwards, I will keep track of this on the "Scheduling" thread instead. |
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Oct 8, 2012 22:12:49 GMT 8
Apart from switching the East Coast game from Tuesday to Monday night, and the Kallang game from Monday night to Tuesday night, and abandoning the 4 to 5 pm slot at Turf City on Sundays, there are 2 new slots: * Sundays, 8 to 9 pm, Indian Association (7-a-side pitch, further up Balestier Road from Khalsa). * Tuesdays, 9 to 10 pm, Turf City (small covered pitch). The same for the Sunday night Indian Association game on 7 October 2012 and the Tuesday night Turf City game tomorrow (9 October 2012). With cancellations every week in the three weeks since 23 September 2012, the Indian Association are reluctant to keep my bookings for me long term, asking that I make the booking as and when required. I don't blame them, as I don't have a track record with them. The difficulty for me is that I get enough players, and then find the pitch is not available. The alternative is to keep the Sunday night game at Khalsa, at least until it takes off. Since I have two other regular games with them, I know they will give me more leeway. Unfortunately, only a 9 to 10 pm slot is available. However, that was the original idea when we first faced enforced changes to schedule just over a month ago, and before I found out about the Indian Association pitch. I'll make the switch from this Sunday onwards. As a new game, I will keep the payment per player $1 less than for a regular game, that is, at $9 per player. |
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Oct 16, 2012 8:49:15 GMT 8
It's hard to get the Sunday night game going when the Sunday evening game is slow to fill up. I won't put the Sunday night game up unless the Sunday evening game fills up early.
|
|
|
|
Post by Rajiv on Oct 17, 2012 22:58:17 GMT 8
|
|
